Each and every day students count on school counselors for guidance and support. This week we celebrate the important work carried out by school counselors. This is National School Counseling Week.
On this episode of the Supercast, we highlight the tremendous impact school counselors have on helping students achieve success and plan for future careers. And, find out how parents and students can connect with their counselors in meaningful ways, especially during challenging times like a pandemic.
Audio Transcription
Anthony Godfrey:
Welcome to the Supercast. I'm your host, Superintendent, Anthony Godfrey. Each and every day students count on school counselors for support. This week, we celebrate the important work carried out by school counselors because this is National School Counseling week. On this episode of the Supercast, we highlight the tremendous positive impact school counselors have on helping students achieve success and plan for future careers. And, find out how parents and students can connect with their counselors in meaningful ways, especially during challenging times like a pandemic.
We're here with Stacee Worthen, our Secondary Counselor Consultant. Happy National School Counseling week Stacee.
Stacee Worthen:
Thank you. I'm excited to be here.
Anthony Godfrey:
Stacee does an incredible job. If you've listened in to Board meeting at all, she's talked recently with the Board about our plan for moving forward with providing great counseling for all of our students and just great support in our schools. Tell me, during this National School Counseling week, what are some of the things that we're focused on in Jordan School District counseling?
Stacee Worthen:
So some of the things that we are focused on is our theme, which is ‘Better Together’. So with school counseling week the entire national theme is Better Together and we really want to make sure that everybody knows that better together means better together. Working with students, working with parents, working with teachers and administrators, to do everything that we can to help our students be successful. How we can actually advocate for our diverse students, our students who just really need that little extra push to get into concurrent, to get into AP classes, but also just to help them find the classes that they need to be successful. As well as deal with some of those mental health issues that we're seeing; stresses, anxieties. Just working together with everyone involved to help their children be successful.
Anthony Godfrey:
Our counselors do a great job of providing a wide range of supports like you just described, which include social, emotional wellness. You know, the old term is Guidance Counselors, that's a term we don't use anymore, because that defines so narrowly what the role of the counselor used to be. It has expanded a great deal to the great benefit of students.
Stacee Worthen:
That's right. Right now we are just known as School Counselors. What many people don't understand is that our background really is about 95% social, emotional, and mental health training. And then we just get a small portion of that academic training when we become school counselors and go back to get our masters.
Anthony Godfrey:
So connecting students with opportunities and helping with class schedules and helping manage schooling is absolutely a part of the counselor role, but it is so much more than that. And it's a great support to students through social, emotional wellness, through issues they may be struggling with. Just with feeling a connection and having an advocate there at school. So I guess what I would say is when people think about school counselors, I hope they're thinking very broadly because there are so many supports available through our school counselors.
Stacee Worthen:
That's right. And really what we're doing in Jordan School District is we're trying to focus on the whole child. So really what we try and do first is look at, okay, are there any barriers to helping that be successful? And if it is anxiety, if there are some social, emotional things, obviously that child's not going to be successful in their classes. And so we really need to take a look at what we can do to help. Maybe it's a better sleeping routine. Maybe it's talking to parents about some supports with anxiety or MHAP referral, where we look at some outside mental health assistance to try and get that student, so as a whole child, they're successful mentally, physically, then they can actually move that into their academics.
Anthony Godfrey:
When I have friends and family members contact me and say, “Hey, my child's going through this. What should I do?” Almost every time my advice is to call their counselor. Connect with the school counselor, see what they can do. They know the resources and they can talk with your student and they can really help.
Stacee Worthen:
That's right. We start there first and they really are the experts in all of the supports that we can use to get that child to be successful. And, you know, if it's a referral to a social worker, if it's a referral to the school psych you know, if it's just us working, you know, one on one with that student, they really are your best place to start.
Anthony Godfrey:
And it's in partnership with parents. There's a lot of communication with parents just as really a support.
Stacee Worthen:
Yep. That's right.
Anthony Godfrey:
I do just wanna say I'll stack our counselors up against anybody, anybody in the country, because there's this focus on supporting students and that's been happening particularly in the last few years where we really track the time that we're spending with students. To be sure that we maintain that focus on that one on one interaction, the group interaction with students, connecting to students to be a direct support to them.
Stacee Worthen:
Yep. That's right. And I would actually put my counselors up against anybody in the nation. They really are working smarter, not harder. They're using data to really drive all the decisions that they're making in their buildings. They really are working to try and get all of their students on track for graduation, trying to give those supports. They're doing BRISC training. So if they have that additional mental health training, they really are amazing. And not only that, but they have swept the state in awards for the last little bit.
Anthony Godfrey:
Listeners, we did a podcast on that and we did sweep all the awards. We have incredible counselors in this district.
Stacee Worthen:
We do.
Anthony Godfrey:
And I would say they work smart, but they work really, really hard. And they are so dedicated and just looking for every way they can to support their school, students, families, provide great opportunities and help, like you said, remove those barriers to success.
Stacee Worthen:
Yeah. They just love kids and they will work so hard to help them be successful. They're amazing, amazing people.
Anthony Godfrey:
So if you're listening and you have students in school in Jordan School District, and you haven't talked with your child's counselor, give 'em a call. Shoot 'em an email. It's a great connect.
Stacee Worthen:
Yep. Thank you.
Anthony Godfrey:
When we come back, how to have healthy conversations with students on the safe use of social media.
Break:
Hello, I'm Tracy Miller, President of the Jordan School District Board of Education. There are seven members on the Board of Education, one in each voting district. We are committed to listening and serving our constituents as we work together to provide the best possible learning environment for the students we serve. As members of the Jordan Board of Education, we believe it is our duty and responsibility to: increase student achievement; provide parents with the choices they deserve and desire; recognize and reward quality in educators; empower school leaders through policy governance and professional development; and communicate with the public, legislators, business leaders, cities, and parents. We invite you to get to know the Board member who represents you in your voting district, and to please join us at our monthly board meeting held on the fourth Tuesday of every month. Or listen from the comfort of your home, on our live stream. For more information and to find your Board member, visit jordandistrict.org. With parent and community input and support we will continue our work to give students every opportunity to succeed in Jordan District schools and beyond. Thank you for your support. We look forward to seeing you soon.
Anthony Godfrey:
We're here with Alyson Law, a counselor at Fort Herriman Middle School to talk about what middle school students are experiencing right now. We're all experiencing things we haven't before, the world has changed, the world has shifted. How has the world shifted for middle school students lately?
Alyson Law:
Well, I think in a few different ways, it's mostly social, right? This is such a time for adolescents to explore who they are, but we're seeing students who are behind a few years in social norms and appropriate behavior. Sometimes our seventh graders are acting more like fifth graders because they didn't get that training of how to behave appropriately because we were masked and we were quieted and we were seated. And so a lot of the typical fifth grade kind of rowdy behaviors that would typically be addressed in fifth grade are now coming out in seventh grade because we had this little bit of delay. So I think one of the biggest socially is them learning how to interact with each other in an appropriate level at the right time, in the right place.
Anthony Godfrey:
You make a really good point. And I think fifth grade to seventh grade is a great example of how large an expanse of two years is for a young person, as opposed to an adult. For me this last two years seem like a really long time because of everything that we've gone through, everything we've had to deal with, but for someone who goes from the age of 10 to 12, that is a huge leap. There are all kinds of changes that happen. And the interaction with, with students and going from having one teacher with a few rotations to having seven teachers is a really big change to go through, given that there's a pandemic happening all at the same time.
Alyson Law:
Right? And if you think of like the percentage of their life that that two years has taken up, right, that's a large percentage compared to the percentage of my life or your life. And there are so many skills that we as adults have mastered. And sometimes we just assume that the kids also have. We forget how much our teachers teach our children about behavior in social settings, because they have them for those eight hours.
Anthony Godfrey:
And you're right. They've been attending school and interacting with each other in a very different way. And I want to go back to the percentage of their life. I mean, I'm more than four times as old as a seventh grader. I don't like to point that out frequently, but I'm quadruple their age. So the impact of those two years for them is a lot larger and it feels like a much longer time to them than it does to me, even though, as I said, it feels like a long time.
Alyson Law:
Yeah, I agree. And I think like something to keep in mind as adults, as I've been talking to a few of our youth, is that we talk about like, ‘oh, I know this has been really hard.’ There were a lot of parents who were upset about things being canceled and their kids weren't able to experience certain things that they had experienced when they were in school. And one of the kids I was talking to said, ‘this is normal for us.’ They didn't know any different, right? And so I think as parents and as adults, sometimes we're making a bigger deal of, ‘oh my gosh, you're missing out on all of this. And there's so much that you're not doing’ and to the kids, they don't know any different, and then we point out that there's something lacking and then they feel like, oh, well, something's lacking.
Anthony Godfrey:
What you just said is a really good reminder of just how influential we are as parents on how our kids react to certain things that are happening around them and happening in society. Probably more than we even realize. I have a seventh grader and sometimes it feels like I can never set the tone for how he feels about anything. But I think it's something that I probably need to think more about is making sure that I'm doing my best to frame things in a way that's productive.
Alyson Law:
Right. And mimicking, right? Mimicking is such a big part of learning. Our teens are in this second, this resurgence of brain development, similar to their toddler years. And when they were toddlers, we were teaching them, hold my hand, you know, and we were constantly teaching them. We have that responsibility to do that now for their development, but it does look different, right? We don't want to helicopter, but we need to be involved. Trying to find that mix, I think, is tricky. But when they see, and we can have those conversations with them, and they see how we've handled hard situations or things in life, that aren't always the best situation. And we mimic that for them, or we teach them and they can mimic, or we give them opportunities to do that. That's the most helpful teaching that we can do, that interactive teaching.
Anthony Godfrey:
I don't do it nearly enough, but every once in a while, I do actually talk through some things that I've had to deal with at work or with other things in personal life or whatever else, rather than hiding what I have to go through to problem solve. I've tried to talk through some of my own problem solving, not in response to anything that he's going through, but just so that he's a part of what I'm doing as well. And like I said, it's rare, but it's been rewarding for us to talk about it, because he asked some questions and he's interested. I'm also amazed at how much he hears, you know, that I didn't think he heard, but that's another story.
Alyson Law:
Well, one of the things, my mother was a brilliant school counselor as well, my mother-in-law. One of the things she always said was the best way for a teenage brain to grow, any brain to grow, is to spend time with an older, more mature brain. That exchange of perception is how our brains grow and mature. In adolescent years, they wanna be with their friends. They wanna tell their friends all their problems and rely on a 13 year old brain to solve a 13 year old brain problem. And that doesn't always help. So having those chances at the dinner table or in a car ride, it seems to be a car ride with my kids where they bring that stuff up, but having a chance to have those exchanges of perceptions and realities is the best way to help our kids move through and develop and mature a little bit faster.
Anthony Godfrey:
I love that concept of bringing some experience to bear on an issue, because if it's only discussed among a group, that's the same age and with the same level of experience, then they may be missing out on some solutions. As important as those interactions with peers are, it's nice to have that additional experience brought to bear. Social media is something that is constantly talked about. And it's of particular concern in the last few months where there have been TikTok challenges and it's always a source of potential bullying or difficulties for middle school students. First of all, it's difficult for everyone, social media's creating issues for everyone regardless of age. What are some of the impacts that you're seeing and what are some things that you've seen work to mitigate those impacts, the negative impacts on youth?
Alyson Law:
I think the biggest thing that I'm seeing, and this might just be because I had a group on this earlier today, is body image issues, not just for girls, but for boys as well. There's so much comparison. And there's so much, now there's the filters and such an altered view of reality that as adults, our brains can understand, that's a filter. That's not real. But teenage brains, even my 10, 11 year old daughter, we were looking at something and she's like, ‘oh, she's beautiful.’ And he’s like, ‘that's fake. That's not really who she is.’ And that concept was hard for her to grasp onto that that wasn't reality. So I think body image and comparison issues on one end, obviously there's some, some deviance that comes with it. But I think the bigger thing is that they're now exposed to more content that is more suitable for adults, not like triple X rating, adult content, but just things that adult behaviors that kids don't understand, that they can't quite grasp concepts and make sense of it. And so in their eyes, that's just what you do. And, and so they're doing it not fully grasping consequences or things like that.
Anthony Godfrey:
So, they may not have the context to properly process what they're seeing.
Alyson Law:
Absolutely.
Anthony Godfrey:
And will view adult postings through a 13 year old lens and the two don’t match up and some misperceptions of the world and how it works result.
Alyson Law:
Yes, and I think like if you go back to when we were teenagers and there was a sports player you idolized or an actor or something, right. You could, you could see yourself wanting to be like them, but also realizing they're a basketball player, but ‘Hey, maybe I could be a famous basketball player too.’ Right. And you kind of go through that stage of, this is what I wanna do.
Anthony Godfrey:
I always knew that was not going to work out for me, but there were other famous people I was looking for, but yes.
Alyson Law:
Right. Actor, whatever it is, someone famous, but you know, and we think when we’re that age, like I'm going to be this famous person. And then as we go through those developmental years, we're like, okay, that's probably not realistic. I don't know that that's happening because the kids are constantly, that's not going away. Right. Like the exposure to the perfectness of social media, there's always someone new to step into that and to compare themselves to and it's so broad versus those small niches.
Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah. You used to know a lot less about people, and you used to know a lot fewer people, even celebrities. We probably know more celebrities than ever before.
Alyson Law:
Right, and different types of celebrities. There's now YouTubers and influencers, right? There are different types of celebrities that gather these amazing, huge followings.
Anthony Godfrey:
How do you approach a middle school age child about social media as a parent?
Alyson Law:
When we are asking our kids to form an opinion and express their opinion to us as adults, whether it's our own personal kids or our students, I think that gets intimidating for them because they don't want to be wrong. Right. Even though we create a safe environment in our classrooms, in my office, even at our homes, there’s still that fear of rejection because that's the developmental stage they're in. And so having that opinion versus what they've experienced is a little trickier
Anthony Godfrey:
You know, that does make sense because sometimes when I ask my son something, and I really am trying to find out the experience or perspective, he's looking at me to see what's the right answer here, what am I supposed to be saying? As opposed to let me think about how I can accurately convey what I'm going through.
Alyson Law:
One of the rules in my office actually comes from my husband and what he's set up with our kids, is I'll have a lot of kids say, ‘oh, I don't know.’ And I'll say, “you know the I don't know rule. I don't know is not an answer. It shuts down your brain. You can say, ‘let me think about it. Or I need more time. Or I haven't thought about that yet’. But quickly we accept ‘I don't know’ as they don't wanna talk to me or they really don't know, where it's just, they might need more processing time to really think about it.
Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah. That language is really important. ‘I don't know’ is a dead end. Like, oh, dead end, end of the road. But that's a really good point. It’s been awesome having a chance to talk with you. I have new ways to talk with my seventh grader now. And it's always a process just to continue to connect with our students, our kids, people that we know, especially through these difficult times, but thank you very much for your insight and advice and for everything you're doing to help the students at Fort Herriman.
Alyson Law:
Well, thank you. I appreciate it.
Anthony Godfrey:
Thanks for joining us on another episode of the Supercast. Remember education is the most important thing you'll do today. We'll see out there.