Supercast

Anthony Godfrey:
Hello and welcome to the Supercast. I'm your host, Superintendent Anthony Godfrey. In Jordan School District, tracking data on everything from literacy and math scores to student graduation rates, rising enrollment, and more is essential to the work we do. Following the data shows us trends so we can improve and celebrate student success.

On this episode of the Supercast, we sit down with the dedicated team responsible for research, evaluation, and sorting out Jordan School District by the numbers.

We're talking today with the Department of Evaluation, Research, and Accountability here in Jordan School District to talk about Jordan by the numbers. Thanks for joining us. Introduce yourselves and let's talk Jordan by the numbers.

Ben Jameson:
Awesome, well, I'm Ben Jameson. I get to be the department's director and it's a pleasure to be with you today.

Brooke Anderson:
Hi, my name is Brooke Anderson. I'm the data scientist working for Jordan District and working with Ben, and it's very exciting to be here.

Anthony Godfrey:
The newly appointed data scientist. It's very exciting to have you in that role.

Brooke Anderson:
This is my first day as a data scientist at Jordan District.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, I'm glad we can memorialize it through the podcast here. Let's just start off with talking a little bit about what your roles are. Your role is brand new, Brooke, so you get to make it whatever you want it to be. But Ben, let's start with you.

Ben Jameson:
So I supervise quite a few assessments that are state and federally mandated as well as a few district-mandated assessments. And then we're responsible for disseminating that data and making sure that people understand what it is and know how to make data-driven decisions based on that data.

Anthony Godfrey:
And many of those assessments, as you indicated, really are not district-required assessments. Those come from the state or the federal level. A vast majority of them, in fact.

Ben Jameson:
Yeah, the vast majority actually come from the state. We've got a couple from the federal government as well. Yep.

Anthony Godfrey:
And Brooke, tell us about what you have been doing in the department and about your new role as a data scientist because that may be a term that many are not familiar with.

Brooke Anderson:
Well, I've been working as a teacher specialist in evaluation research and accountability and in that role, I was cleaning and analyzing all of this assessment data and trying to combine it with all of the other data available that we have about students to ask and answer bigger and better questions about student learning. That's really the goal. The role of a data scientist specifically works on asking questions that are important to the organization and in combining data from multiple sources to make sense of it. To make sure that we can get all the data from the different information systems that we use. Turn it into usable data and analytics that can lead to knowledge that can lead to action. So a data scientist is all about making it easier to make decisions.

Anthony Godfrey:
And to make data-driven decisions.

Brooke Anderson:
Right.

Anthony Godfrey:
So it's really exciting to talk with you both about this. If you've ever watched Shark Tank, the panel of entrepreneurs on Shark Tank always say know your numbers. And they throw that out at the questions about what are their sales and what of all this. So those who listen to the podcast after this will know their numbers when it comes to Jordan School District.

Brooke Anderson:
That's right.

Anthony Godfrey:
So let's start off before we talk about the changes in Jordan which I do want to talk about, let's just talk about where we are, how large we are, the makeup of our population, our student population, that sort of thing.

Brooke Anderson:
Fantastic. We are a large school district. Currently we've we've got about 57,829 students enrolled and we are probably going to have about that same or a little bit more this year enrolled. Normally we take enrollment counts as of October 1. So school districts in the state wait until October 1 to get their official count of students enrolled in their school district.

Anthony Godfrey:
School funding has changed a little bit. That October 1 count used to be where all of our funding came from. That’s been updated- daily membership is part of that.

Brooke Anderson:
To an average daily membership. Yes, that's right.

Anthony Godfrey:
But October 1 remains that date where we say, "Okay, everybody's pretty much registered for the school year. We're underway. People who are going to drop off of the rolls have dropped off. So now we pretty much have a solid number."

Brooke Anderson:
That's correct.

Anthony Godfrey:
It's interesting though, Jordan School District is the fourth-largest school district in Utah and even more interesting, the 70th largest district in the nation. Now do you guys know how many there are? So we're number 70, how many school districts are there roughly in the nation?

Brooke Anderson:
Over 13,000.

Anthony Godfrey:
Somebody asked me that the other day and I tried to look that up so I'm glad to have the right number from you. And how many districts are there in the country overall?

Brooke Anderson:
Over 13,000.

Anthony Godfrey:
So over 13,000 we're 70th in terms of enrollment, fourth in the state. I know that Granite, Alpine, and Davis are ahead of us I'm not sure in what order. We are growing but we're growing at a slower rate than we're accustomed to. Birth rates have dropped and not as many people are moving in. How recently was it that we really had big growth?

Brooke Anderson:
I'd say our largest period of growth was about five years ago, pre-pandemic for sure.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah, that's my recollection as well that it really did taper off. It's interesting, all districts are experiencing that and really it's being experienced across the country. It's an interesting phenomenon.

Brooke Anderson:
It is. It's especially interesting, you know, thinking of where we were ten years ago and looking at our enrollment comparison to Granite, who is our next-door neighbor. And at this trajectory, we're going to maybe surpass Granite in enrollment within the next couple of years because their enrollment is dropping so steeply.

Brooke Anderson:
Let’s talk about schools. Talk about the number of schools we have at each level and the type of schools that we have.

Brooke Anderson:
So we have 68 individual schools. 40 of those are traditional elementary schools and we've got one online elementary school. We have 12 traditional middle schools, one online, six traditional high schools, one alternative high school, and one online high school. And we have a special needs school for students in K-12. We also have a special needs school for adult students. We have two career and technical academies and we also have a preschool which we run for students with special needs before they enter kindergarten.

Anthony Godfrey:
A wide range of services.

Brooke Anderson:
Exactly.

Anthony Godfrey:
Lots of different schools throughout a growing area. So with all of that talk to me about the changes that we've experienced as a district over the years. It's really quite interesting to look at those trends.

Brooke Anderson:
One of the major trends we've had is that we're becoming diversified. So if you looked at our enrollment 10 years ago We would have had only about 20% of students who would be considered a racial or ethnic minority. And now we're almost 30%. So that's quite a big change over the course of 10 years. And it's a wonderful change because that means that more diversity is being included in our schools. And of course, we've got an increasing amount of diversity in our staff as well. It's not quite to the level of where our students are, but it is increasing.

Anthony Godfrey:
Not only have we grown as a district, but our enrollment has changed and it's shifted.

Brooke Anderson:
Right, it's much more concentrated toward the south part of the valley. We all know that area has built up so much in such a short time. And of course, there are fewer students in the north side of our district. So the needs of where we need to put students in school buildings have shifted pretty dramatically.

Anthony Godfrey:
It's interesting to watch. When I first worked in Jordan's school district, I applied as a teacher. I was excited about Jordan because I knew that it was a growing district. So I thought that would mean more and more opportunities. I worked out at a school that no longer exists, being a middle school out in Copperton, that was torn down due to any number of reasons. New schools were built. And I was always told, "Hey, out here in Copperton, you see all these fields and you can't see where the next house is from Copperton, but all those houses are going to fill in all the way to Copperton eventually.' And there's been a lot of progress in that direction. A lot fewer fields and a lot more homes and that's what we're finding on the west, westernmost edge of our district and in the southwest area as well.

Brooke Anderson:
Copperton is still our only rural part of the district that would be considered rural.

Anthony Godfrey:
Okay.

Brooke Anderson:
But maybe not for long.

Anthony Godfrey:
Not for long, not for long. I lived out in Copperton, I loved Copperton, it's a great spot.

Stay with us when we come back, we dive into growing graduation rates and district enrollment.

Break:
Hello, I'm Tracy Miller, President of the Jordan School District Board of Education. There are seven members on the Board of Education, one in each voting district. We are committed to listening and serving our constituents as we work together to provide the best possible learning environment for the students we serve. As members of the Jordan Board of Education, we believe it is our duty and responsibility to: increase student achievement; provide parents with the choices they deserve and desire; recognize and reward quality in educators; empower school leaders through policy governance and professional development; and communicate with the public, legislators, business leaders, cities, and parents. We invite you to get to know the Board member who represents you in your voting district and to please join us at our monthly board meeting held on the fourth Tuesday of every month. Or listen from the comfort of your home, on our live stream. For more information and to find your Board member, visit jordandistrict.org. With parent and community input and support, we will continue our work to give students every opportunity to succeed in Jordan District schools and beyond. Thank you for your support. We look forward to seeing you soon.

Anthony Godfrey:
Tell us a little bit about maybe some surprising facts about Jordan District that people might not be aware of. What makes Jordan unique?

Brooke Anderson:
Oh, I would like to talk about some of the things that have changed with our enrollment and bringing in new students. Did you know that we have 82 different birth countries represented, students from 82 different countries attend Jordan District?

Anthony Godfrey:
I knew we had a lot. I could not have told you the number 82. That's really remarkable. That's amazing.

Brooke Anderson:
The students in Jordan District speak 58 different languages. We're getting about 8% of our students are learning English. They're in the process of learning English. And then some of them, of course, already know English, but we have 58 languages represented among our students as well.

Anthony Godfrey:
And tell everyone some of the most predominant languages spoken.

Brooke Anderson:
Of course, the most predominant languages, English, then Spanish, then Portuguese, then Arabic is number four, Vietnamese, Chinese, Tongan, Samoan, Russian, and Mongolian.

Anthony Godfrey:
Fascinating. We really do have a broad range of students from a lot of different backgrounds and that's exciting.

Brooke Anderson:
It is.

Anthony Godfrey:
Let's talk about student achievement. Let's discuss some of the areas where Jordan has been doing particularly well and is on an upward trend and some areas where we really have been working on trying to improve.

Ben Jameson:
So I think maybe the best place to start is right at the beginning with early literacy in our early grades. We put forth a great deal of effort to help our students read on grade level by third grade and I'm excited with some of the numbers that have come out most recently. Just for instance, 71.7% of kindergartners are reading on grade level at the end of last year. That's the highest that it's ever been in Jordan School District. Even by third grade, which was that time where students transitioned between learning to read to reading to learn, 71.3% of our third graders are also reading on grade level, meeting literacy benchmarks at the end of third grade. So we're super excited about that.

We're seeing actually quite a bit of growth across grade levels. For instance, 65% of students in grades K through 3 made typical or better growth, which is the highest that it's ever been in the school district. Kindergarten students, again, not only did they have the highest proficiency, but they had the highest growth rate that they've ever had at nearly 59% of students making typical or better growth. 66% of second grade students made typical or better growth, which again is the highest that it's ever been. I keep saying that because it feels so good to say.

Anthony Godfrey:
It does feel good to say that. And we're doing things we haven't done before. We have the Walk to Read program that we rolled out a couple of years ago. We had piloted it a year before that. And teachers have worked very hard-- coaches, administrators, folks from teaching and learning, parents, students. Everyone's been working really hard to get those results.

I'm particularly excited about the boosting scores for kindergarten students. So they're getting a better start in Jordan District than they ever have before. And a great predictor of graduation rates is the percentage of students reading on grade level in third grade. And a great predictor of that is how well students are doing in kindergarten. So I think we're gonna continue to see the positive impact of the students learning to read at an earlier age and with greater proficiency.

And I also wanna point out, a year's growth and the typical or better growth is harder to achieve than you might think because you may have students who are very advanced coming into a class and that statistic reflects their growth as well. It's just not, are you reading on grade level or on the expected level for your age and grade level? It's that you've made growth wherever you started, whether you started with a very low reading ability or very high scores, it's that you grew for the entire year and you made that progress that we would expect and teachers are working really, really hard to make sure that happens.

Ben Jameson:
It really is a celebration for everyone involved, all of our stakeholders. And it's exciting to report that we're making such progress.

Anthony Godfrey:
Talk about graduation rates.

Ben Jameson:
90.2% of students in the graduating class of 2022 were able to graduate, which is the highest in Jordan School District that it's ever been. And that's super exciting for us to report as well. Having talked about growth in early literacy, this kind of bookends the hard work that's going on at the other end of the educational spectrum.

Anthony Godfrey:
It's really exciting to have the highest graduation rates we've ever had. It's wonderful and we're going to keep working on that trajectory. Coming out of a pandemic, it's really important that that number continues to grow.

I think what's important as well is the work that has been done to be sure that that graduation is even more meaningful than it's ever been. That the experiences that lead to that graduation are rich learning experiences. And again, our teachers have worked so hard to create great classroom environments, great learning environments for our students. So that not only are more students graduating than ever before, but they're having a better experience in learning more than ever before.

Brooke Anderson:
And we can also see that students are being offered more options for the courses they can take in high school, particularly advanced college and career readiness courses. We can see that the number of students taking CTE courses, for example, has increased. It's the highest it's ever been in 2022 and 2023 to about 19% to 20%. We love seeing that and that's up from about 16% in 2015 so we like getting more students into those kind of classes.

Anthony Godfrey:
A variety of experience is really important. It's something we focused on and we want to prepare students for a lot of different things after high school whether it's career, whether it's college, whether it's technical training. So we're not solely focused on college where we have many programs that lead directly to careers or to licensing programs or to other post-secondary educational opportunities. So really the nice thing about having so many students in so many schools is we have a critical mass of people that are interested, that are going to be interested in a wide variety of programs so it allows us to offer more and more of those specialized courses.

Brooke Anderson:
One of my favorite tasks every year is being able to update a master course catalog with all the new courses that have been added.

Anthony Godfrey:
Right.

Brooke Anderson:
We've been able to add things like the history of Disney in America, Everyday Chemistry all of those fun courses that I look at that and I think I wish I could take that course.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah, absolutely. There's a Rock-and-Roll course that I would really like to sit in on. These are meaningful courses focused around skills and dispositions that we want students to have as they as they graduate. We're working right now on the Portrait of a Graduate process under the Board's direction. And we're getting community input, employee input, student input on what skills do we want students to have, what knowledge, what dispositions when they graduate from Jordan School District. And having that input and really putting that plan in place is an exciting process too. So I think we're going to continue to make progress along these same lines.

Brooke Anderson:
We've certainly made progress in the amount of students taking advanced courses. We have 34% of our students in grades 9 through 12 taking AP, Concurrent Enrollment, Secondary Math 3, very advanced math, all of those kind of college preparation courses, which is great to see.

Anthony Godfrey:
Which speaks to the preparation that leads up to students being ready for those courses, but also that we have educators encouraging students to take more challenging courses and really inspiring students and helping them understand their own capabilities and seeing beyond what maybe they thought they were capable of. Let's talk about some of the areas where we know that improvement is needed. And we've been working hard, but we're maybe shifting our focus and trying some new things to see if we can impact those scores in a positive way.

Ben Jameson:
So RISE is the summative assessment that is mandated by the state that we administer to students in grades three through eight in language, arts, math, and science. And so we've been monitoring those scores, particularly through the height of the pandemic and keeping a watch on those scores and how they've been affected by, you know, the various impacts that the pandemic brought along. We did see a drop during the pandemic in all three content areas. We are starting to see a bounce back in the content areas, especially in the elementary grade levels. But we definitely need to still continue to work and keep an eye on our performance, especially at the secondary levels in language arts, math, and science. I think that is something that we are focusing on with teachers even on a daily basis. They're working hard to help students recover some of the learning gaps that came about because of all the things that happened during the pandemic.

Anthony Godfrey:
Right. And there's so much, you know, we've talked about the pandemic so much, of course, over the last few years and the impact that it's had on learning. And some folks may be tired of hearing that. And we don't want to have a deficit mentality where we're always focused on where we're falling short. But we also have to be realistic about the negative impact that this had on students.

If you think about how much you changed from, say, sixth grade to eighth grade, or second grade to fourth grade, or ninth grade to being a junior in high school, those two years were not normal years. And so the development and the academic achievement wasn't where it normally would have been. And so we didn't get the interactions with each other and the school setting and all of that in the same way that students normally benefit from.

So we're still going to be playing catch-up on that, but we've really focused on looking forward and celebrating success and building on the successes that we have. And I really think that we're going to continue to see this upward trend as teachers and students and families have really worked hard to overcome those setbacks. We've talked about where we've come, where we are. Let's talk about where we're headed.

Brooke Anderson:
So Jordan District in the next five years we've reached kind of a plateau in our student enrollment and we expect that plateau to continue as demographics may shift a little bit, enrollment may shift in different parts of the district, but really we're expecting to see things to stay pretty stable for the next few years.

Anthony Godfrey:
And we've seen explosive growth for a long time so it's a different adjustment, but like you said it's a shift also in where those students are moving.

Brooke Anderson:
Exactly.

Anthony Godfrey:
Also, let’s talk a little bit about Tableau- what Tableau is, how we're using it, and how it allows us to make those data-driven decisions in the district.

Ben Jameson:
So Tableau is a data visualization program that all of our school administrators and many of our district administrators, coaches, counselors have access to that allows them to both see data and even interact with it so that they can adjust filters to see for instance, how are my students with disabilities doing in this particular subject area? Or what's the reading level of my students that are learning English as a second language? It's exciting because they're able to ask questions about the data, and then interact with the data to be able to get the answers that they need to make decisions they need to make and create plans that will help students achieve at even higher levels. We're very excited about the ways that we can use Tableau and we'll get to use Tableau even more now that we have a data scientist.

Brooke Anderson:
We've been getting more and more questions about student learning which is exciting because you never know what's the next question that we can answer that would help us move forward.

Anthony Godfrey:
The data is really important because at the end of a teaching day, or even as a parent, it's difficult to know am I having the impact that I hope I'm having? And this data allows us to see that yes, teachers are having a great impact on students. They're learning more than ever and they have better opportunities than ever before.

Brooke Anderson:
That's true.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, thank you very much for spending the time with us today, but also thank you for all the hard work you're doing to make sure that we have the best information we can to make the best decisions we can.

Brooke Anderson:
Thank you.

Ben Jameson:
Thank you. We appreciate the invite.

Anthony Godfrey:
Thanks for joining us on another episode of the Supercast. Education is the most important thing you will do today. We'll see you out there.

Anthony Godfrey:
Hello and welcome to the Supercast. I'm your host, Superintendent Anthony Godfrey. Threats of any kind against a school are always taken seriously, even if the threat is not considered credible, comes from out of state, or originates in another country.

On this episode of the Supercast, we go behind the scenes with police and district safety personnel to find out what happens when a threat is reported or uncovered. Hear about the immediate steps that are taken, and how we work closely with local law enforcement to keep students, teachers, and staff safe.

We're talking now with two of the experts that we work with anytime that we have a school threat. Please let's start by having you introduce yourselves.

Cody Stromberg:
I'm Cody Stromberg. I'm the Deputy Chief of Police for Herriman City.

Matt Alvernaz:
I'm Matt Alvernaz, the new School Safety Coordinator for Jordan School District.

Anthony Godfrey:
And tell me a little bit about your career path that brought you to this point.

Cody Stromberg:
Sure, I started my career back in 2006, worked in Sandy City and then for the Unified Police Department. I was assigned to Herriman City in 2011, and I've been there ever since. Working for the Unified Police Department and doing community policing in which I was intimately involved with a lot of our school projects, crossings, safe walk routes, school evacuations and reunifications, and all of those types of activities. And then when the Harriman City Police Department separated from Unified Police in 2018, I went over there as a lieutenant in charge of our operations division. And I'm now the deputy chief where I oversee 55 full-time and over 60 part-time employees.

Anthony Godfrey:
We're very grateful for your assistance day-to-day and in the case of emergency, of course. And thank you very much for taking the time to be here.

Cody Stromberg:
Of course. Thanks for having me.

Anthony Godfrey:
If you have to stand up in the middle of the podcast and leap into action, I will understand.

Cody Stromberg:
They don't usually call me unless something really bad happens. So I think we're safe.

Anthony Godfrey:
Let's hope there are no calls.

Cody Stromberg:
Yeah.

Matt Alvernaz:
His days of leaping are over.

Anthony Godfrey:
Okay. Okay, that's good. Matt, talk a little bit about what brought you here.

Matt Alvernaz:
So I'll be brief on my background. I started with the Army. I did four and a half years there. Got out in 2009. Started with the San Diego Police Department, worked about seven years there. And decided to move the family to Utah. And it's been good. We started with the Saratoga Springs Police Department. And I got into the schools, working as a school resource officer. An opportunity opened up to kind of blend the two with this newfound love of the education side mixed with the law enforcement side and real big concerns of school safety. So it's a great opportunity and I appreciate you guys bringing me on board.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, we're thrilled to have you, and Matt we're going to have you back on the podcast to talk more about your position and what's involved and your journey here. But thank you for your time today. Tell me about some of the types of threats that come in regarding schools. And, really we're talking about this because from time to time there are these false threats online but we never consider them that until we've looked very carefully at the situation. We take every threat seriously. Speak to that first of all.

Cody Stromberg:
Sure. I think we have to take every threat seriously. The reality is in the world of law enforcement everything is as it's reported until proven otherwise. And if you look at some of the statistics, particularly that the state legislature has been gathering through safety and other avenues for the last few years, the reality is that these threats have been happening for a long time. They're just now a little bit more public because of the world of social media in which we live.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah.

Cody Stromberg:
And the reality is that a school violence incident is every parent's and every educator's worst nightmare. And so we have to take that threat seriously until proven otherwise.

Matt Alvernaz:
Along those lines, I mean, it's good to be precautious, right? You never want to say, “hey, you knew and you didn't do.” It's easier to start with a bigger scene in the law enforcement world then we could shrink it back down. But if you come in too light and now you're trying to expand it because it's worse than you thought, that's harder to do. So we come in, we're taking it for what it is, make it a big scene sometimes, and we shrink it down as we determine it's less valid or less of a threat than we initially thought.

Anthony Godfrey:
Talk me through what happens when you first hear about a threat on social media. There's a nondescript threat. It's not specific to a school, but students in a certain community are starting to spread it around. And in their minds, they're assigning it to the school that they attend because they've received it from someone that they know.

Cody Stromberg:
The upside and the downside of social media is that these threats tend to spread like wildfire, which can be good in the sense that we tend to hear about them more quickly than we used to.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah.

Cody Stromberg:
But on the downside, they also can sometimes get misassociated to the wrong school, or they get exaggerated beyond what the original statement was. A lot of times, we get reports from concerned parents who are forwarded information from their student or their child, students sharing information back and forth on social media platforms, particularly.

I think, as I mentioned before, I think the SafeUT app and some of the other efforts that our state government has been involved in recently have helped us to kind of direct those attentions in a positive way and guide that information to where it needs to be. Because when we first receive a threat, we go through our standard investigative process. We try and figure out is it a legitimate threat, where is it specific to, or is it specific to anywhere, and that will dictate our response, where you could see anything from a physical response of additional officers in school to kind of a behind the scenes, more quiet response where we can identify a specific individual and we have investigators or officers that will go contact that individual directly and go through our investigation that way.

Clearly, those types of threats are a serious concern. There are criminal statutes specifically related to making threats against schools now that allow us a little bit more latitude to push these investigations further. But the reality is the world in which we live is one of rapid information. And sometimes that information is inaccurate, which makes it difficult at times for us to respond appropriately.So like Matt was saying, we'll start wide and then we'll try to narrow our focus from there.

Matt Alvernaz:
Yeah, the information we get is pretty fluid sometimes. It's like, oh, we got, it's over here. Well, hold on, we're getting new information over here, but we can't ignore the previous information. So we have to kind of be ready to adapt and respond. And so you'll have different levels of facets of the response, you know, physical presence there while doing stuff behind the scenes.

Social media does have the advantage of leaving that digital footprint. We can track things, which is great. People think Snapchat's, you know, got that erase. No, we'll get it. If it comes down to we can dig deep enough, you know, with recent incidents. Snapchat was how we were able to make our determinations through warrants and get that kind of stuff going. And I don't want to speak too much because it was th department who did that, but it was a fantastic job. But yeah, so I mean, it's both a blessing and a curse.

Anthony Godfrey:
And what you just said, Matt, re-emphasizes the importance of those strong relationships that we work on all the time, is making sure that we have good communication because neither one of us can be as responsive to schools as we need to be without helping each other out.

Stay with us when we come back, more on potential threats targeting schools and how we work with local law enforcement to hold the suspect or suspects accountable.

Break:
In Jordan School District, we like to support students in and outside the classroom along with their families. That's where the Jordan Family Education Center comes in, offering support services and a wide variety of classes for students and their families, free of charge. You can take a class called Blues Busters for children feeling sad or worried. Just Breathe is a class that helps students reduce stress. Or how about a class that supports parents in helping their children make and keep good friends. There are also support groups and free counseling, all provided by Jordan School District school psychologists and counselors. To find out how you can benefit from free family support services offered by the Jordan Family Education Center, call 801-565-7442 or visit guidance.jordandistrict.org.

Anthony Godfrey:
Walk us through the steps that you take once you find out about a threat from a police department standpoint and from a district standpoint.

Cody Stromberg:
For us, we receive that information through a multitude of sources. One, of course, is the SafeUT and the resources that are set up through the state. We get a lot of information from parents directly. Like I said before, we'll get a lot of information from students who will pass information to their SRO and it comes to us that way or it comes from the school because information has been reported to your staff and then comes to us.

So our first step, again, is to identify as quickly as we possibly can where that threat originated from. And if it originates from a specific student that's somehow connected to that specific school, then obviously that gives us a good place to start. And then if it doesn't, then we start looking at our external areas. We start doing, as Matt indicated before, we start looking at, you know, warrants for social media or we try to trace IP addresses, that type of thing. We have a lot of partnerships available to us to get through some of that stuff.

But that's usually our first step is to try and place an element of credibility on it as quickly as we can. Because if we can place an element of credibility on it then we also have to start developing some sort of a safety plan or some sort of an action plan related specifically to that threat and then we work it backwards from there. We start- if we can identify an individual- we start looking at a criminal investigation and we move that direction.

But the first- the first real piece is is it a real threat or is it not? And I say real, but the reality is they're all real threats. Is it a threat that's credible or is likely to be carried out? Or is it something that somebody just said because of you know they're venting or we have a mental health crisis or things that are happening that our youth are impacted by? And sometimes, let's be honest, kids say dumb things sometimes so they're not meaning that they're gonna go through with it but we have to treat it that way until we can prove otherwise. So we have to put an element of credibility on it and then we start trying to trace where it came from.

Anthony Godfrey:
And as you described in regards to recent events, it's establishing does this even apply to our area? Was this even intended as a message for any of our cities?

Cody Stromberg:
And a lot of that happened simultaneously, I can tell you, with the specific incident we were dealing with on Friday, the SRO obviously was intimately involved in, “okay, what's the plan” but I also had a detective who was assigned to do the warrants on the IP address. I had a detective who was assigned to follow up on social media accounts. I had a detective who was assigned to liaise with the district and pass information back and forth. So a lot of that stuff kind of happens simultaneously until we get to a point where we can confidently say that we don't believe the threat is credible and then we might scale it back. But there's a lot of things that have to happen in that first few minutes and whether the report comes from SafeUT, or from the district, or from a parent or student, the reality is the process is much the same. And then we make sure that we loop in our partners. If we get a tip from SafeUT or from a parent, then we'll call the school and deal with administration directly. We'll bring Matt into it and try and make sure that we're all on the same page and operating off of the same set of facts.

Matt Alvarnaz:
And the report comes to the school exactly the same way, you know, whether it's students reporting it directly to us, we see it through Safe UT, we catch it on social media, or the police department lets us know in reverse. Our response is you got the principals, they're there, they're on the ground, you got the school staff, faculty, and we continuously train on this kind of stuff.

You've got your initial information. If you have a name, if you have a lead, the first thought for the principals is what's the way to make it safe? How are we gonna make the school safe? Is it a lockdown situation? Is it a secure situation? Is it kind of just okay, we have flippant comments here let's work with the police department to determine more of what we have.

In the case where we keep referencing on Friday when that information came to us police department was already there. Their presence was fantastic. I saw these guys out there working, doing their various things. The uniform presence in and out of the school was awesome.

I was there to help alleviate for the principal's task. He still has a school to run and he's dealing with the parents, phone calls, doing all this stuff. So my job was to help deal with the law enforcement side of it. However we can assist, because at this point you get a threat like this- yeah it's against us, but they're the ones with the tools and the resources. If we find out some information, it's not us who's gonna go do it, it's them, right? If there's some validity to it.

So how can we be a resource to them at this point? Meanwhile keeping our focus on making sure the kids are safe. And how can we assist that and stay out of their way? Keep the kids safe- out of the way- and continue to operate that way, and that's where that partnership comes in.

Continually deal with that message. Make sure we're on the same page with that. What we put out needs to match what they're putting out, or don't release information too soon because it might compromise the investigation. Because they know information they don't want the potential threat to know. If we run out and say it, you know, it might damage what they're doing. So yeah, for us it's how to, that initial response, we're there first in a sense, the SRO is there, but make it safe, be that resource and watch the kids and continue to run that school and go from there.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah.

Cody Stromberg:
I think you mentioned something really important, Matt, that maybe we don't always consider and that is the disruption that these threats sometimes cause to the school particularly. You know, even a non-credible threat causes significant disruption to the school day whether we do lockdown or lockout or secure or not. The reality is there are a lot of kids who either don't come to school because their parents don't want them to. Or, you know, they get checked out in the middle of the day or they don't go to class. Or just the anxiety that some of our educators face. The teachers in the classroom are having to try and keep control of the kids while all this is going on and try and have a normal school day while they're waiting for information, right?

I think that's something we don't talk about enough is the disruption to the teachers and the students who are actually in the school not having a lot of information but still having to go through, you know, their school day and it's really, really difficult. That's one of the things that we don't really have great answers for because again, we have to treat every threat as a real credible threat until proven otherwise, but we also just can't immediately say that it's not. So there's certainly an element of disruption that occurs that makes it really, really difficult for our teachers, too.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah, I appreciate that. We really try to balance it out, like you described. We want to be responsive to every threat, take it very seriously, but minimize the distraction and the disruption that it creates.

Let's speak to the statute that's out there, that it's a recent change in the law that allows you to pursue more aggressively those kind of false threats and perpetuating those false threats.

Cody Stromberg:
There's been a lot of change in the legislature recently specifically related to school safety. I'm sure that you guys are very well aware of the new school security task force that's being headed by Representative Wilcox through the law enforcement and criminal justice committee in the House. We have members of law enforcement, members of the education world that sit on that committee. Their focus really is trying to identify through the various data that we receive, what truly are our issues or responsibilities specific to school violence and how can we make our schools safer for children. And they're doing a lot of work to try and identify things like statewide standardized best practices.

When we have these types of events we talked about, you know, do we necessarily want the Jordan School District to respond differently than Canyons does or differently than Granite does? The reality is that in law enforcement our tactics and our response is usually fairly universal, and we're trying to apply that to the school setting as well. So that it doesn't matter where the threat occurs, the response is going to be the same.  And we develop those standardized protocols that are designed and promoted for efficient operations but to gain the most positive outcome from whatever the situation is that's going on.

Even within law enforcement, between agencies, we use different verbiage for things and different codes for things and it can get confusing at times and those are things we're trying to avoid.

Anthony Godfrey:
The right terminology is really important. If we're not using the same terminology then it's much more difficult to provide a coordinated response.

Cody Stromberg:
Right.

Anthony Godfrey:
What advice would you give to a parent who finds out or a student who sees a post that seems to be a school threat? They're not sure where it's coming from, they're not sure whether it applies to their school. What are some of the first steps that they ought to take when they see that?

Cody Stromberg:
It's almost a double-edged sword in some sense, right? And like I said before about the availability, the rapid availability of information can sometimes be beneficial. Because in that one case– I don't know if you know this, but they've had– SaveUT puts out a report every year of the interactions that happen on the app. There were over 800 confirmed threats of violence against schools last year in the state of Utah. 800. So depending on how many contract school days we have, we're dealing with this several times a day throughout the state.

But we don't want that one that we didn't think was serious to become serious. And so the reason I say it's a double-edged sword is I want to know about it as quickly as we can. There certainly are better avenues to report it than others. Sharing it with your friends is not a great avenue to report information. It does kind of tend to complicate some of these issues sometimes when they're being shared amongst peer groups and not elevated.

So the only thing I would say is, I would like you to not press share. But if you're gonna press share, then also send it to Safe UT, send it to the school, send it to law enforcement so that we can investigate it. And we can go through the proper channels of sifting through the data and the information and trying to identify- backtracking to the source and what information is credible versus what's not.

Kids are gonna share stuff on social media. I was sitting at a high school football game last Friday watching these kids in the stands and they were just, the speed at which they share information on social media is unbelievable. Like, I don't know how their fingers don't cramp up every night when they get home because they're all over the place, right? And so it's gonna get shared. And I don't know that there's anything we could ever do to prevent that. I would love to, but I don't think it's realistic. So the only I would say is to also send it to SafeUT. Send it to us. Send it to the school so that we can begin as quickly as possible to vet out what's credible information and what's not. And we run into that one situation in 800, heaven forbid, that's the real deal that we can begin to respond immediately.

Anthony Godfrey:
Sharing is not reporting. That's the bottom line.

Matt Alvernaz:
If you press share, you send it out, it creates panic. It inflates the issue, makes it so much worse than it needs to be. And then misinformation starts going. People who panic and want to reshare because they're concerned, okay, there's some of that, but there's also people with malicious intent who think, “Oh, this will be fun. Let me spread this out. Let me alter the rumor. Ooh, let me expand on it.” And it just makes it worse. And then the resources that go into, you know, addressing it and confirming it or making sure it's more safe is, it's just, it becomes wasteful. It becomes dangerous and all sorts of things come into play with it. The best thing you can do, is tell your trusted adult, report it to the school and the law enforcement. It doesn't really matter the order on that because we have that cohesive partnership.

Anthony Godfrey:
Let's talk about what factors we consider when putting together communication for parents because as much as we don't want students sharing with each other, once we have adequate, accurate information, then we want to share that out with parents so they can make decisions and understand what's happening.

Matt Alvarnez:
So we have to make sure our information is accurate. So nine times out of ten, the students- you just talked about how quick they are with those phones and pushing out information. They hear a blip of a rumor. We have most of the truth, we just haven't been able to put it out yet. They will put out whatever they hear.

So parents say, "Why am I hearing it from my kid first?" So your kid's got a half-second delay on what they shoot out.

"Well, we have to make sure we're accurate." If I just start parroting everything we hear, again, panic, and misinformation.

“Why are you so disorganized? Why aren't you on the same page with the police department?” If they put out information they have, it’s different from ours, well, that's just incompetent right there. At least it's how it's gonna appear. So we have to be responsible with our information, but we do get it out quickly. As quickly as we can in a safe manner. And again, as of that cohesive partnership.

Anthony Godfrey:
You're right, we coordinate closely with law enforcement on those messages. Talk about the law enforcement end of those messages.

Cody Stromberg:
Yeah, and the transparency piece is huge for us in law enforcement, and that's something we're very passionate about in Herriman. And I know that all of the police departments the Jordan School District share the same sentiment. We've had these conversations before. How do we push out information to parents? When do we push it out? What do we say? And how do we do it in a way that helps either relieve some of their concerns or address some of the issues without adding to the panic and the confusion, right? And so the partnership certainly is key, as Matt alluded to. We spent most of the day on Friday back and forth on the phone with the district's communications team with the threat that we were dealing with at Herriman High School.

From the law enforcement perspective, the safety of students is obviously the highest priority, but we also have to factor in things like traffic impact, right? If we suddenly have a bunch of parents who show up to a school wanting to pick up their kids, how do we manage that? How do we provide them accurate and adequate information that they can then make a reasonable informed decision as to what they're going to do with their student? And so we try, like Matt said, we try to push out information as quickly as possible, but we're also obligated to push out the truth. And we have to make sure that it's vetted and we have to make sure that we have a plan and that we're addressing the issues that need to be addressed as opposed to being a part or facilitating and spreading rumors, which is usually not helpful.

Anthony Godfrey:
What's interesting to note, especially in some recent events that we dealt with, is that sometimes something starts in another state, states away from where we are. But it spreads through social media and there are lots of abbreviations for school names that end in HS and that can be applied to many schools nationwide or a reference to a mascot or that sort of thing. We've seen that over the years. So that's part of the reason that we have to take a little bit of time to verify the information. If we know there's an imminent danger, we're going to communicate that immediately. It’s making sure that we've followed up on the information we receive and we're sending out the most actionable information, the most useful information to parents so that they can make a clear choice.

Cody Stromberg:
Yeah, I think you're exactly right and that's exactly the situation we were faced with last

Friday with a message that originated from out of state but because of some references to homecoming and because of some acronyms that were used, suddenly it ends up in our backyard and we're trying to sift through where that came from.

Now we certainly have a lot of partnerships, both at the state and federal level, that allow us to rapidly move through some of that information and do some of that back tracing. But at the same time, that doesn't help the panic that happens for the two or three hours before that information goes out to the public, right?

Anthony Godfrey:
Sure.

Cody Stromberg:
And so we wanna make sure that we're responsive to the parents. But what I tell the parents most often is, exactly as you said, Dr. Godfry, that if we had a legitimate and credible threat that we felt the safety of students was in jeopardy, we would let you know.

Anthony Godfrey:
Right. Immediately.

Cody Stromberg:
Right. Immediately. We would let you know immediately. We would have a plan to address it. We would tell you what the plan is, for the most part. We don't necessarily divulge all of our tactics, but we would tell you what to expect. And if you're not seeing that from the police department, then we're probably in a pretty decent place. And if things change, we'll let you know.

But at the same time, you can't discount the feelings that the parents have, right? I have four children in the district. And when things like that come across my desk or through social media, I have the exact same first thought, which is where my kids are, my kids okay? And then you work through the rest of it. And you have to respect that, those concerns that come from the parent level.

And so we're trying to push out information that we have, but we wanna make sure that it's accurate. So just like you said, we work through that. If there were a credible threat that safety of students was in jeopardy, we would certainly let people know immediately and we would have a plan to address it.

Anthony Godfrey:
I can't thank you both enough for taking time today, but most of all for everything you do to keep our students safe. We've worked with Herriman for a long time very effectively, and it's obvious how much you care about students. And all the officers we work with in all the cities, how much they care about keeping students and teachers and employees safe. And Matt, we've worked with you before as an officer and now on staff here at Jordan, and we're very grateful for your dedication to everyone's safety as well. So thank you both for everything you do. Our schools are very, very safe places to be and they will continue to be with your efforts. So thank you very much.

Cody Stromberg:
I can't speak highly enough of our partnership with the Jordan School District and something that's been long-seated and has been going on for a long time. And you've carried that tradition forward certainly in identifying new ways that we can be more efficient and effective. Like you said, I think our schools are very, very safe. But we can always do better. So we're always looking for ways to make improvements and so these types of discussions, and the information that comes out of what can be a stressful situation sometimes becomes very valuable in helping us to identify better ways to do things in the future.

Anthony Godfrey:
Absolutely, well thank you very much.

Thanks for joining us on another episode of the Supercast. Remember, education is the most important thing you'll do today. We'll see you out there.

(upbeat music)

Anthony Godfrey:
Hello and welcome to the Supercast. I'm your host, Superintendent Anthony Godfrey. Students and history teachers alike are excited to celebrate, after Governor Cox declared September “American Founders and Constitution Month” in Utah. It is a month where students are encouraged to read directly from the founding document each September 17th, which is the anniversary of the creation of the Constitution in 1787.

On this episode of the Supercast, we head into West Jordan Middle School, where they have a passion for learning about the Constitution and celebrate it by participating in a “We the People: competition every year.

We're here at West Jordan Middle School to celebrate Constitution Day and the fact that Governor Cox declared September as “American Founders and Constitution Month” here in Utah. So we have two adult Constitution experts and several student constitution experts. Go ahead and introduce yourselves before we start talking constitution.

Kaye Rizzuto:
I am Kaye Rizzuto and I am the Jordan District Social Studies Consultant.

William Shields:
My name is William Shields. I am an eighth-grade US History teacher and a ninth-grade American Institutions and Issues teacher here at West Jordan Middle School.

Anthony Godfrey:
Now tell me about those last classes that you mentioned there because those aren't offered at every one of our middle schools.

William Shields:
No, and it's actually a really cool story. After “We the People” happened a lot of students recognize that there is a large gap in the history classes from when they learned about US History from 8th grade to 11th grade, and they were really eager about wanting to keep sharp in terms of the founding documents. Keep up on connecting the past to the present and looking at those important things that make up our nation in much more depth. And it was actually driven by students. I had the wonderful opportunity to work with the counselors here, people at the district, to actually write the curriculum for it.

Anthony Godfrey:
That's fantastic. In other words, students were craving more American history at a deeper level, and you're providing that between 8th grade and 11th grade. That's fantastic.

And Kaye, tell us a little bit about your position so that those listening understand a little bit more about it.

Kaye Rizzuto:
So I am in the district office. I'm the administrator over all of social studies from kindergarten through 12th grade.

Anthony Godfrey:
And you provide great support to teachers and help us all kind of get on the same page and move forward and create a lot of space for creativity on the part of teachers and it's really exciting.

Kaye Rizzuto:
Thanks. And, I'm helping to get them supports and professional development. I actually have a team of elementary teachers working on creating curriculum for the entire state on the new elementary social studies standards.

Anthony Godfrey:
The state is wise. "Hey, we need some help. Let's go to Jordan District and grab some great teachers."

Kaye Rizzuto:
Yeah, exactly.

Anthony Godfrey:
So you mentioned “We The People”, and that's the competition that we've covered on the podcast previously, but can you describe that a little bit for those who may not be familiar with it?

William Shields:
It’s a wonderful nationwide program that was actually written between, I believe it was in the late 70s, with a combination of a Supreme Court Justice and some congresspeople, to really encourage schools to take a deeper dive into analyzing the Constitution and founding period principles and topics. And encouraging it in both an individual and a collaborative way so that the students can then work together, prepare a speech, and then respond to questions that would mimic a congressional hearing. So that's really the rundown, is it encourages students to do a deeper analysis of constitutional issues, and then prepare a defense.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, so these students are going to know the Constitution at a deep level because they've had to question it and defend it.

William Shields:
Correct.

Anthony Godfrey:
All right, well, let's talk with them and see what they have to share with us about the Constitution. These are 9th-grade students who are now in Mr. Shields's classes to extend their American history knowledge. But last year you were all competitors in the “We the People” project. So why don't you introduce yourself and let's talk about the Constitution a little bit.

Gerardo:
I'm Gerardo. I'm in 9th grade.

Savannah:
I'm Savannah. I'm in 9th grade.

Ava:
I'm Ava and I'm in 9th grade.

Anthony Godfrey:
Why don't you tell me first of all what is your favorite amendment? It doesn't have to be the most important. They're very important, but what's your favorite? Either because it's interesting or because of the impact it had or because of the way it fit into the “We the People” competition?

Gerardo:
My favorite amendment would be the First Amendment because it talks about the rights all of us have as people living in the US.

Anthony Godfrey:
What do you think the US might look like if we didn't have a First Amendment?

Gerardo:
It would look way worse than if like some things look nowadays. Because it's never gonna be perfect, but it will look a bit less better than it is right now.

Anthony Godfrey:
And how about for you? What's your favorite amendment?

Savannah:
I agree. I think the First Amendment is one of my favorites.

Anthony Godfrey:
And why is that one your favorite?

Savannah:
I think it's important to all of the things that it covers. Talking about freedom of speech and stuff like that and how we get to express ourselves.

Anthony Godfrey:
Do you like expressing yourself as a middle school student in America?

Savannah:
I do. I think it's nice to have an opinion in certain matters.

Anthony Godfrey:
I agree. I agree. Makes our country a lot better to be able to express those opinions. And how about you?

Ava:
Mine is actually also the first.

Anthony Godfrey:
How did learning more about the Constitution for the “We the People” competition change you and the way that you view just your day-to-day life or the country or your family or school? How did it change you to learn more about the Constitution?

Gerardo:
Since I already liked history it kind of motivated me to like become a lawyer when I grow up which is one of my main interests because of this class.

Anthony Godfrey:
And is there a particular aspect of the law that you're interested in?

Gerardo::
Civil rights.

Anthony Godfrey:
Civil rights, okay great. So this may set you on a path toward a career this this class and this experience.

Gerardo:
Yeah.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, I wish you well I'm sure you'll do great. How about for you? How has learning more about the Constitution changed you?

Savannah:
It's been interesting to learn about parts of the Constitution that you don't necessarily think about on a daily basis. And in “We the People” we got to talk about court cases. It was cool to see how the Constitution gets to defend the people in this country and how we use it in our daily lives and for things like court cases.

Anthony Godfrey:
Okay, great. And how about you?

Ava:
It helped because I never actually liked history growing up. I thought it was really boring because I never realized that in history you also learn about the Constitution and stuff like that. So when I took the class it just kind of helped me learn about other things and it actually made me want to be a lawyer too to protect certain amendments.

Anthony Godfrey:
Tell me what's it like being in Mr. Shields' class?

Gerardo:
It's a fun class and he's an interesting teacher. He's really funny and he actually helps us learn a lot from his teachings.

Anthony Godfrey:
I've seen him out and about, he's a cool cat. I expect his class would be very fun, very funny.

Savannah:
I agree. I think it's cool to see him teach. You can tell that he loves what he teaches and he puts it in phrases that makes it easy to understand for us.

Anthony Godfrey:
That's great.

Ava:
It just makes school a lot more fun. It's what I look forward to every day. He teaches us really important stuff but still makes it in a way that it's enjoyable to learn about.

Anthony Godfrey:
So if there needed to be an amendment to the Constitution to allow you to be in his class, you'd fight pretty hard for that to get put into place and ratified.

Ava:
Yes, sir.

Anthony Godfrey:
Alright. I know as part of the ‘We the People’ competition, you focus on a particular topic from the Constitution. What topic did you focus on and what can you tell me about it?

Gerardo:
My group focused on freedom of speech and we were talking about this court case versus some students who were wearing black armbands to school and we were talking about how the government was like invading their rights as humans.

Anthony Godfrey:
And did you side with the students?

Gerardo:
Yeah

Anthony Godfrey:
I thought you might have as did the Supreme Court, right?

Gerardo:
Yeah.

Savannah:
My group also talked about freedom of speech. One of the cases we got to talk about revolved around a speaker that talked to a small gathering group of members of the KKK and they were putting together a riot. And by speaking he was becoming an accessory to the crimes that they were going to commit and the things that they were going to do. We got to talk about whether his speech would be limited based on the things that he was saying and the things that he was trying to get people to do, and we got to talk a lot about criminal syndicalism laws.

Anthony Godfrey:
Wow, and should his speech have been limited?

Savannah:
Yes, by encouraging them to join in on the riot he was becoming an accessory to their crime.

Anthony Godfrey:
Okay, very good.

Ava:
My group talked about political parties and how they started. It went all the way back into the arguments between people who were running - well, I guess they weren't running for an office. But the cabinets and the vice and about what the disagreements were and why they ended up making the Republican and the Democrat parties and basically what their values are.

Anthony Godfrey:
And do you think it's good that we have those two parties?

Ava:
Yes, 100%. It helps people be able to express themselves in a way that not everybody gets to learn because it's private so not everyone has to know your opinion.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, I'm super impressed with everything you know about the Constitution. And it's a great way for me to celebrate Constitution Day by having a chance to talk with you so thank you very much and keep up the great work.

Students:
Thanks.

Stay with us. When we come back more about what we're doing in schools to educate students about the Constitution.

Break:
Hello, I'm Sandy Riesgraf, Director of Communications for Jordan School District, and we want to invite you to connect with us. So many exciting things are happening in your child's school, your neighbor's school, in every school here, every day. Don't miss out on following the fun or simply staying informed when there's important information we need to share. Join us at jordandistrict.org, or follow us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram @jordandistrict. We can't wait to connect.

Anthony Godfrey:
Now let's talk a little bit about how we've commemorated the Constitution as a state and as a country over the years.

Kaye Rizzuto:
So September 17, 1787 is the day that the Constitution went into place, that it was signed, and that's why Constitution Day is on the 17th of September. Throughout the years many different states were recognizing it but eventually by 1956 President Eisenhower made September 17th and the week of September 17th, Constitution Day and Citizenship Day, to recognize the Constitution and being citizens of the United States.

Then this past spring, the Utah State Legislature wanted to increase that awareness, and they passed a bill making the month of September Founders Month so that we can honor the Constitution and our founding fathers during the month of September.

Anthony Godfrey:
When you said 1787, Schoolhouse Rock automatically starts playing in my head. Hopefully, some other listeners that's happening to you as well.

So tell me, what is it that you think people may be -- what are some misunderstandings about the Constitution that are common out there when you're teaching students or when you're talking with other folks who know that this is what you do day in and day out?

Kaye Rizzuto:
I would say that there's often some misconceptions between the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. Like you'll hear people say the phrase, it's in the Constitution that we have the ‘life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness’, but that's actually not correct. That's in the Declaration of Independence. And so you'll see some misunderstanding about the two documents.

William Shields:
And to kind of add upon that, I think that there's a misunderstanding that the Declaration created the government that we have today. The Declaration was one of the world in history's best breakup letters with Great Britain. And so they had the early Articles of Confederation but from 1776 to 1783, excuse me 1787, it was a really weak constitution through the Articles of Confederation and in 1787 that's when the government that we have today was formally ratified. And so I think that that's one one of the big kind of learning points is the United States actually had an early constitution that wasn't the same one as we had today.

Kind of to echo what Ms. Rizzuto said, also that the Constitution is a living document. That it is something that as we see through the 27 amendments, changes can be made. But also through the impact of Marbury vs. Madison and judicial review, that we have court analysis that really does impact and reassure and reevaluate those items that are discussed within the Constitution and the amendments to make it more applicable to modern day life and situations that we face today that they didn't face in 1787.

Anthony Godfrey:
Let's talk about some of the most important amendments that you cover with students and the changes that they brought to our country.

William Shields:
Well in 8th grade we really, we have the wonderful opportunity to really take the founding period and so we start with the First Amendment and we get through what are known as the Reconstruction Amendments, so 13, 14 and 15. And every single one of them are incredibly important.

I mean first and foremost the importance, and this is towards the latter part, of the the importance of the 13th Amendment and the formal abolition of slavery. The 14th Amendment and the 15th Amendment, both the Due Process Clause, but the 14th Amendment's protection against discrimination. And so my core really kind of stops at the 15th Amendment. We take a lot of time at talking not just about what the amendments say but why.

And so currently in my class were looking at the comparative systems of those European countries that were settling in North America. And looking at, well, what did the United States later use within their constitution from these different ideas? We'll look at the philosophers. The importance, I mean, there are some historical amendments like the Third Amendment with no quartering of soldiers, which we don't really see today. But in terms of property rights, we see the Fourth Amendment all the time. And so even today in my elective class, we were talking about property rights and when is a person liable versus not liable in criminal versus civil situations.

And so within my US class, it's really an amazing analysis of those items that were important to the colonists at that time from 1 to 15. And then it's important for me to continue the story and say, listen, when you get back in 11th grade, it's gonna continue. Like the US is not done finishing the amendments with women's suffrage rights and voting granted. With things like voting term limits for the president that we'll see in the 22nd Amendment, kind of to prime the pump so they're excited to learn more about it when they get to high school.

Anthony Godfrey:
It's the ultimate cliffhanger.

William Shields:
Oh yeah.

Anthony Godfrey:
Hey, 8th grade, we're gonna leave you hanging at the 15th Amendment and then we'll pick up where we left off.

William Shields:
Oh yeah, and that's really one of those things that the students wanted. They wanted to-- they were mad. They were upset. They were like, why are we stopping here? And it was one of those things that it was– as a teacher, it was one of the biggest compliments to say–- for a student to approach me and say, I want to learn more. And I mean, I do stick to my core. But I had the opportunity to then kind of get together with this curriculum and say, OK, let's look at all 27. And not just the 27, but what were the impacting factors? You know, when have, I mean, when have there been, you know, to drop a legal term, stare decisis, when it has been continued on through judicial precedent, when has there been big changes? And so the students really are the driving force to that elective class, and it's nothing that I've been more proud of.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, it's pretty thrilling that 14-year-olds will say, I wanna learn more about the Constitution. I'm going to use one of my elective classes to do that, to create that opportunity. So that's a great tribute to you and to our students who are so interested in our country. So tell me, what impact do you see when students learn more about the Constitution? What are some of the light bulbs that come on for them?

William Shields:
I think, I mean, I could sit here and quote the founding fathers about the importance of an educated citizenry. But to see the light in their eyes when they realize that they themselves at 8th or 9th grade, they are active citizens. That they can communicate with their local, state, and national, and federal officials if they really wanted to. To know that while they don't have the voting responsibilities and rights yet, it's important to know about the system, to know what their rights, freedoms, but also what the limitations of government are.

Anthony Godfrey:
Sure.

William Shields:
And so to really see them, to see their eyes go, this applies to me, this is important, and also to see them be able to identify how it benefits them individually, but also as a community.

Kaye Rizzuto:
One of the purposes of public education is to create good citizens, and that is done by doing these social studies courses throughout elementary school and high school and middle school. That learning about these founding fathers and the documents and all of the things that they learn in these classes is so important in helping them to learn about their role as being a good citizen. And so it's our job as educators to help prepare them to be citizens and to be active in their communities and to do their part to help the country be better.

William Shields:
I had a wonderful opportunity in previous years to talk with the Reagan Institute about the, with State Superintendent Dixon, about the importance of civil dialogue and to build that skill that is so pivotal within our constitutional republic to communicate and to know that there are gonna be different perspective and how we should build those skills to be able to process, view perspectives and have a civil conversation.

Anthony Godfrey:
The author John Meacham has talked about the fact that disagreeing is just part of who we are as Americans. And it's an important element of the strength and health of our country, I think.

Kaye Rizzuto:
And it was part of what the Founding Fathers did when they were making the Constitution. They had to have that civil dialogue, whether it was in Independence Hall or when they were off in the tavern in the evenings, they were having those dialogues and working together to form our Constitution. And it's an important skill that we need to emulate because that's how our country was built.

Anthony Godfrey:
Good thing Facebook didn't exist back then. It would’ve really gotten in the way, I think. Thank you both for everything you do to help instill a love for the Constitution and our nation in our students and for the support you give to teachers. And it's just, I'm really proud of the work that you do and the education that's provided to students around American history and the Constitution in Jordan School District. So thank you for being such an important part of that.

Kaye Rizzuto:
Thank you.

William Shields:
It's literally my pleasure and Kaye's amazing.

Anthony Godfrey:
She sure is. Thank you both.

(upbeat music)

Thanks for joining us on another episode of the Supercast. Remember, education is the most important thing you'll do today. We'll see you out there.

Anthony Godfrey:
Hello and welcome to the Supercast. I'm your host, Superintendent Anthony Godfrey. During the school day, he is determined to provide students with the best educational experience possible at Monte Vista Elementary School. But when the final bell rings, Assistant Principal Andrew Lovell trades the classroom for a pickleball court.

On this episode of the Supercast, find out how Mr. Lovell is sharing his love and passion for the game of pickleball with colleagues. They are colleagues of all ages and abilities who suddenly can't get enough of what has become one of the most popular, fastest-growing sports in the nation right now.

We're with Andrew Lovell, the assistant principal at Monte Vista Elementary School today. Andrew, thanks for taking some time this afternoon.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, thanks for having me.

Anthony Godfrey:
So the pickleball robot is shooting balls at us now. And now do you use this to kind of hone your skills on certain shots?

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah.

Anthony Godfrey:
Oh wow.

Andrew Lovell:
For sure. Yeah, it's a great way to practice, especially if you don't have anyone to play with. You know, I think nothing beats playing with a friend or people just at a pickup game, but this is a great way to work on this very specific skill and to drill it 100 plus times in a row.

Anthony Godfrey:
We are here at Pickleball Courts in South Jordan City and a little known fact is that if you come in 100° weather in the middle of the day, you get every court to yourself. People claim Pickleball Courts are full, but they're not full if you come at one.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, that's true, yeah. Typically, in the evening you can go to a place that has 20 courts and they'll be booked, yeah, middle of the day, 100°, it's a great time to come out and play.

Anthony Godfrey:
So if you could take the heat, come into the kitchen, so to speak. Now, Andrew, we were going to talk a little bit about pickleball in Jordan School District and how it's been part of our health and wellness to start off with. I'd like to learn a little bit more about your connection to pickleball. Tell us about your pickleball past and how you're connected to the sport currently.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, so like a lot of people, I think, in Utah and around the nation, pickleball really picked up during COVID for whatever reason, I picked it up and I just got addicted right away. So I've been playing for about two and a half years and I do tournaments, I play with friends in the Jordan School District, I've helped with Wellness Day and created some leagues. And so it's been a really awesome opportunity to connect with other people. It's a great way to get exercise. It's a great way to stay in shape and also just keep mentally sharp, emotionally and socially healthy as well.

Anthony Godfrey:
Tell us why you think Pickleball is such a great health and wellness sort of activity. Because on our Health and Wellness Day, which we've now done for multiple years, we had a lot of employees come out for that and it was a really good chance for them to connect with each other. And I think that's a big part of it.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, one of the coolest things that I saw at the Health and Wellness Day was just people from all over the district connecting with one another. We had, you know, our custodial staff, we had substitute teachers, we had full-time teachers, we had people from the district, we had vice principals. We had just, everyone was there connecting and no one knew each other, so everyone's, you know, kind of on equal playing field, and you just gotta get out there and play. And it's a great way to just to connect with people. And so that was one of the coolest things I saw, just people making connections through something that they genuinely love to do, which was get some exercise and play pickleball.

Anthony Godfrey:
I know it may be surprising, but I haven't been involved in a lot of sports over the years. And pickleball, it's remarkable how quickly you can have fun with it even if you're not a particularly skilled athlete. Speaking to the connection part of it, my son and I were down in St. George, we’re playing, and another couple of players came up to us and said “Hey, do you guys want to play against us?” and suddenly this competitive fire built within me even though I don't have these pickleball skills to back it up. It was really fun to play with them and it was memorable. So, I'm really excited that we've had that opportunity within Jordan District because of the activities you've put together for employees to connect with each other. So,  you had about 60 or 70 people come to the health and wellness activity. We were fully booked for the day.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, that's right. Yeah, we were fully booked. We actually went for almost 10 hours straight, playing drop-in, and that was just, anyone could come and play. And then we also had two tournaments, a beginner tournament and an advanced tournament, and those were full. And then we created a league after that 'cause the feedback was so great. We had too many people actually to be able to fit everyone in. So then we created a league and we had people come out to that every other Wednesday, twice a month and the response has been tremendous. And I think you can really see that people just genuinely love being outside. They love getting some extra exercise.

We know that our educators, if we can be happy, if we can be healthy mentally, emotionally, socially, spiritually, that we're gonna be better teachers in classroom. And so that's I think that's just one of the side effects that we don't always get to see but we know it exists. We know that happier teachers, healthier teachers make for higher success and learning in our classrooms. So it's just it's a benefit to everyone when we do things like pickleball, not just pickleball, but pickleball has to be one of the best for sure.

Anthony Godfrey:
You get outside there's a little bit of a sense of competition. You connect with other people and I think you get a sense of efficacy like hey, I can learn something I didn't know how to do before. Because it takes a long time to master it but it doesn't take very long to be able to just dive in and have some fun with it.

Andrew Lovell:
For sure. That is one of the reasons, I think, why pickleball is exploding so much. Because the playing field is really level. You have male, female, it doesn't matter the age. You know, I always tell people if you haven't lost to someone who's over 60 years old or if you haven't lost to a 13-year old it's because you haven't played enough. Because there are just so many good people. And you don't have to be- unlike tennis where you really need, you need a flexible, a younger body to be honest, to be able to run those sprints and be able to compete at the highest level, in pickleball you don't. Even at the pro level you'll see people - you'll see older gentlemen, older women, who are competing at the highest levels. And you also see on the opposite end. You see kids who are as young as 13 playing at the pro level.

So it just it's a sport that everyone can do and it's really easy to learn. If you want to be more advanced there's a few techniques you got to pick up, but really anyone like you and your son, you go out there and play. And you can be just as good after a few times of practice so it's awesome.

Anthony Godfrey:
A very successful Health and Wellness Day. Lots of participation in pickleball so much so that you started the league. Now I understand we're starting that back up this fall as well.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, so one thing that we want everyone to look forward to is on Wellness Day we plan on having another set of tournaments and drop in. But then we for sure plan on having another league coming up either in the fall or spring. We haven't fully decided on the dates and well it's gonna work for everyone but that's something we want to continue and we will strive to do.

Anthony Godfrey:
It's difficult to really feel that connection sometimes when we're such a large district and this is a great way for us to try to accomplish that.

Andrew Lovell:
That's right, yeah it can be really difficult and it's like I mentioned earlier. It was really cool to see people from our district offices playing. Their doubles partner is the head custodian from another school and that's just something, you know, an opportunity that you just wouldn't see maybe anywhere else and pickleball really facilitates that.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well count on me for some of those league nights because I know you're gonna get me prepped so I can really show my stuff out there on the court.

Andrew Lovell:
And we can do that. You know, I think for anyone getting the sport there's just a few simple things that we can all work on, including myself, and it's just practice and repeat of a few simple skills and then you can pretty much get to that level. So I hope this can get you the invite to the cool kids party with your wife.

Anthony Godfrey:
I really want to be at the cool kids table, but it's gonna take your help Andrew. Let's get out on the court and let's see what we can we can do.

Stay with us. When we come back.

Andrew Lovell:
And that was a perfect return.

Anthony Godfrey:
Listen as we serve up some fun on a local pickleball court.

Break:
Hello, I'm Tracy Miller, President of the Jordan School District Board of Education. There are seven members on the Board of Education, one in each voting district. We are committed to listening and serving our constituents as we work together to provide the best possible learning environment for the students we serve. As members of the Jordan Board of Education, we believe it is our duty and responsibility to: increase student achievement; provide parents with the choices they deserve and desire; recognize and reward quality in educators; empower school leaders through policy governance and professional development; and communicate with the public, legislators, business leaders, cities, and parents. We invite you to get to know the Board member who represents you in your voting district and to please join us at our monthly board meeting held on the fourth Tuesday of every month. Or listen from the comfort of your home, on our live stream. For more information and to find your Board member, visit jordandistrict.org. With parent and community input and support, we will continue our work to give students every opportunity to succeed in Jordan District schools and beyond. Thank you for your support. We look forward to seeing you soon.

Anthony Godfrey:
We're out here on the court now and I'll just tell you up front I'm left-handed. I assume that's a tremendous advantage.

Andrew Lovell:
You know it actually really is. Playing left-handed I think throws off the majority of players because we're just so not used to it.

Anthony Godfrey:
So I'm starting ahead of the game right now.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah. This is gonna be an easy win for you probably.

Anthony Godfrey:
Perfect. So let's start off with some basic skills?

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, so I'd say the most basic when teaching new people how to play, I just start with the three most basic things which is the first three shots. So the very first shot that we're looking at in a game is your serve. At the beginning you just want to get your serve in. That's the main goal, but as you become more intermediate and advanced you're looking to get your serve deep to the baseline. So that's the back line. The reason behind that is you want to push your opponent back. You're always trying to prevent your opponent from getting to the kitchen line or the no volley zone area.

Anthony Godfrey:
And that is right up by the front by the net.

Andrew Lovell:
That's correct. So you always are wanting to push people away from that. So you want your serve to be deep to the baseline. And again, if you even want to add a little more to that, if you're playing singles it can change a little bit. I like to serve to people's offhand. So if my opponent's right handed, I like to serve their left hand. Another strategy is to serve right between the two, if you're playing doubles, to create a little bit of confusion. But the number one thing is on that serve, you want to have a good deep return.

The second skill and shot to work on is the return. So you serve it to them and they're returning it back. And that return, you also want to do kind of the same thing. You want it to be a deep return, preferably to their off hand or to the middle. And that's again, to keep the other team back and to prevent them from getting to the no volley zone.

And then the third shot is probably the most important. So this is the key. If there was one thing you're gonna go out in there and do besides, you know, dink the ball around, the number one skill that you probably wanna work on as a beginner or someone who's new to the sport is that third shot. There's different strategies and different theories on what to do, but a safe strategy is called the third shot drop. The third shot drop is essentially, when someone's returning it to you, you want to use light hands and drop the ball right into the kitchen. And what this allows you to do is it allows you to run up while that ball is softly and gently falling into that kitchen and allows you to jump up to that kitchen line or no volley zone line. And it allows you and your partner to get settled up at the front. And that shot is extremely important and it's also something that really does take time. That's something that tennis players aren't used to. A lot of tennis players who come to the sport, they really want to slam the ball a lot and that can be an effective strategy, but in pickleball, you really want to work on that third shot drop.

Anthony Godfrey:
The third shot drop. So now the rules about the kitchen are that you can't hit from the kitchen unless it has bounced in the kitchen, is that right?

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, yeah, essentially you cannot hit the ball out of the air while standing in the kitchen. So you could stand in the kitchen all day and you could just stand there, however, you're not allowed to hit the ball. So the general rule is you stand back at that no-volley zone line, that line that's close to the net, and you wait for the ball to come at you and then you decide what you're going to do. If the ball falls in the kitchen, then you can step into the kitchen and hit it, but if it's coming in the air, you need to be behind that line.

Anthony Godfrey:
Okay, let's see a serve. Now you serve it right out of your hand and you just hit it out of your hand. Can you bounce it? Is it legal to bounce it?

Andrew Lovell:
It is legal to bounce it, so you can bounce it. Most people don't. Most people are hitting it right out of their hand and you kind of have to come through from a downward to upwards motion.

Anthony Godfrey:
You can't hit down on it. You can't do an overhand serve.

Andrew Lovell:
Exactly. So as opposed to tennis you can't do an overhand serve. It's an underhand serve.

Anthony Godfrey:
Alright let's see an underhand serve that takes them far back. Okay. That sound is satisfying, isn't it?

Andrew Lovell:
It's kind of like a baseball in a ballpark. It has the same feeling.

Anthony Godfrey:
So how would you describe it? This is kind of like wiffle ball and ping pong and tennis all combined.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, yeah, I think that's a that's a great description. It's ping pong, it's badminton, it's tennis all combined.

Anthony Godfrey:
Are you putting some spin on as you hit these? Or are you just making sure that you get the placement where it needs to be?

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, so a little bit of both. There's a little bit of topspin coming on there right now. Some people will... they've actually made some serves illegal. So there's not too much… There's not too much you can do. Some people used to put a lot of a lot of different types of spin on it but for the most part there's just a little bit of topspin. Anthony Godfrey:
What's the illegal about some of the serves?

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, so about a year ago the governing body of pickleball decided to kind of outlaw some of the ways that you could serve. One of those ways was you would take the ball - so if I'm right-handed I have my paddle in my right hand and I have the ball in my left hand and instead of just releasing the ball and hitting the ball over the net they would release the ball, but spin it with their left hand and so when the ball is coming off the paddle it had an additional spin to it. I can't do it. I never was able to do that.

Anthony Godfrey:
So you can't spin it out of your hand and then spin it.

Andrew Lovell:
That's correct it you couldn't spin it like that.

Anthony Godfrey:
All right. I'm gonna go over and try to return some of these serves. Now you told me that the trick is to try to return deep to keep you back. So I'm gonna try that. Now remember, people listening to the podcast can't hear whether I hit it great or not so it's up to you right how you choose to describe it. Okay here I go, I’m going to the other side.

Andrew Lovell:
I'm gonna serve straight to Dr. Godfrey's - he's a left-hand player actually, so I'm actually gonna go to his right hand here and see what he does.

And that was a perfect return! I wish the people actually could see this because that was that was amazing. He's already learned, he's already mastered it. His wife needs to invite him to the next party. Here we go.

We'll do another one and this time I'm going to serve it to his left hand. So this is the hand that he would prefer to hit it with. And again, perfect. He served it deep and it was right to the center. In doubles that would have been an ideal return right there.

Anthony Godfrey:
So is there spin on this again? Are you trying to spin in a particular way?

Andrew Lovell:
I'm just trying to give it over.

Anthony Godfrey:
Oh, right in the corner. That would have been a tough one to return for anybody. Okay.

Andrew Lovell:
Pickleball was, I think invented somewhere, I think 1965 out in Seattle. So it's been around for a long time, but it really got popular during COVID. And I think we're somewhere around 35 million players right now in the US.

Anthony Godfrey:
The people who invested in it in 1965 are finally saying, my ship's come in. Now Andrew, you're new to Jordan School District. Tell us about your career to this point and what brought you here.

Andrew Lovell:
Yeah, so I was teaching prior to this in a neighboring school district down south. I taught for seven, eight years in elementary school. And I just had the opportunity to come up here, Jordan School District, after graduating from BYU. And the opportunity was there, took it, and it's been the best decision that I ever have made, hands down. And that is not just because you're here, I'm on this podcast, but literally, it's been life-changing. I’ve met amazing people and done amazing things already.

Anthony Godfrey:
Well, we are thrilled to have you here and I can't thank you enough for choosing Jordan and for helping us out today.

Andrew Lovell:
Absolutely, anytime.

(gentle music)

Anthony Godfrey:
Thanks for joining us on another episode of the Supercast. Remember, education is the most important thing you will do today. We'll see you out there.

(upbeat music)

Anthony Godfrey:
Hello and welcome to the Supercast. I'm your host, Superintendent Anthony Godfrey. She is traveling the world on a quest to collaborate and connect with educators and students in countries thousands of miles away.

On this episode of the Supercast, we sit down with Fort Herriman Middle School Assistant Principal Lisa Jackson to learn about Global Education Allies. It is a group of educators participating in international education travel, hoping to develop global awareness and foster innovative learning in classrooms. They even develop lifelong friendships in their travels with teachers and students from all over the world.

We're talking today with Lisa Jackson, an assistant principal in Jordan School District, about her experiences traveling around the world learning about schools in other countries. Lisa, thanks for taking the time.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, thanks for having me.

Anthony Godfrey:
Tell me about how you got involved in this. What's the organization? How does all of this work?

Lisa Jackson:
So in 2016, my daughter was graduating from high school. She wanted to do something different for her senior trip. Another educator told me they had been to Africa with this group. So I checked into Global Education Allies, interviewed with them, and she and I went on a three-week adventure to Africa where we visited lots of schools, we did a lot of service, we raised money, and that just kind of started my love for seeing what school is like in other countries and around the world.

Anthony Godfrey:
Wow, so what is the stated purpose for this organization to exist? What is their mission?

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, so they're bringing together educators from around the world to collaborate, to discuss cultural issues, to just have shared experiences so we can collaborate with each other and learn about each other's education system.

Anthony Godfrey:
So this is fascinating to me because we always hear about, well, in this country or that country they do something that really solves everything and makes everything work. Just any of the countries that you visited, tell me some of the things that have really stood out to you. Like, “Hey I wonder what would happen if we tried this?” or “There's no way we could ever do this, but it works here.” What are some of the things that have just been the most memorable as you've as you visited these countries?

Lisa Jackson:
I would say there's something really memorable about every single country. So one thing I want to just state though is my experiences in these different countries is probably not indicative of the entire country. It's the areas that I went to, the schools that I was taken to, for example in Africa, I was taken to the poorest villages. Only one school in that area did I go to that was anywhere near what we have here.

Anthony Godfrey:
So it is that's a really good distinction. It's important to say that the schools that you visited in these countries, not what are schools like throughout the country. I visited schools in China, visited schools in other in other states, visited schools in France, in various countries as well, not in the in-depth as you have, but every time I visit a school, I do have to remind myself of exactly that. One school is not emblematic of what's happening in education throughout an entire country or even an entire district or state or wherever else. So tell me some of the take-aways, some of the things that you've learned. Let's start with Africa. What countries were you in in Africa and tell me about the village and what you learned there.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, so the country I spent the most time in was Uganda. We also went over to Kumbala. In Uganda, I was shocked at the conditions. Many of the schools we went to, dirt floors, doors didn't go all the way to the ground, so they're sharing the classroom with bugs, with animals. Everything is handmade. There's no books in the classroom. We actually brought suitcases full of books. We helped to build a library over there.

But the one thing that really stood out to me was the kids are the happiest kids I've ever seen. We would go out onto the playground with them and there's nothing, there's maybe an old metal swing set, but you've never seen such big smiles. And they're doing cartwheels and they're pushing a old tire with a stick. And it made me realize we don't need all the things we think we need to make kids happy. We just need to love them. That's really all they need.

Anthony Godfrey:
That's pretty amazing. So you were there in the summer?

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, so all these trips have been summer. However, I just got back from the South Pacific and it was their winter. So in both, in Africa, China, and the South Pacific school was in. In Finland, school was out. So we met with lots of educators, didn't actually see many students. In all the other countries, we were watching class. In some of those countries, we were teaching class with them, teaching English, just working with kids. And I absolutely, it kind of combines both my passions, traveling and education together. So it's the best of both worlds for me.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah, that's fantastic. So tell me about, let's talk about Finland.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah.

Anthony Godfrey:
What did you learn in Finland? Where did you go? What did you find out about education there?

Lisa Jackson:
So you know, Finland is known for having one of the best education systems in the world.

Anthony Godfrey:
Right, teachers are valued, people are happy, scores are high.

Lisa Jackson:
Lots of teacher trust, no like extended recesses, shorter school days, no homework. So many things that in theory sound phenomenal. What I did learn is they're really not that different than us, they really aren't. Their pay is very comparable to ours when you consider cost of living in both countries. Teachers have their issues there as well, we all do.

The one thing I took away from there that has kind of stuck with me is we do special education in the United States really well. When looking at their special education system, I really think that we take the individual student into account. And I was kind of proud of us for that, even though they have some great things and they're scoring phenomenally.

One thing I absolutely loved about their country is in high school, students are able to pick a path so they have a no-dead-ends policy. So if students, maybe traditional college is not going to work for them, they go to a vocational high school. So one of the vocational high schools we visited was a farming school. So the kids spend a good part of their day learning how to farm, how to work the land had to take care of the animals and when they graduate they have a career path. We do something similar. We have our JATC South, we have extended and college into a high school, but this was a career path as soon as they exit school and I was really impressed with that.

Anthony Godfrey:
It's interesting to hear that a lot of what they do is very similar to what we do and that you know the no dead end. I love the idea of that that there's a path for everyone. We just need to find the right match up. Now you've also visited China. Tell me about what you learned there.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, China was a different experience. China was with many educators. There was lots of Jordan School District administrators as well. In that situation we went to their finest schools. We went to their top schools, saw their top performing students. I felt like their education system is very different that ours. They're very proud of it. There was a lot of good, like I remember distinctly one student walking us around saying, "Don't you think our school is beautiful?" And it was, and I would love for our students to feel that kind of pride in our schools.

But I also noticed the teaching is very teacher-centered. Teachers are on a raised platform. Students have a specific way that they sit, a specific way that they answer questions. There's a lot of sit and get. So, while they have some great things going, I also took away that we have some great things going from that experience.

But I loved being immersed in their cultural experiences. The one thing I learned is even though our countries might be a bit divided, that doesn't mean the people have to be. We had some great relationships with some of the Chinese educators and the people that took us on our tours and they're wonderful people.

Anthony Godfrey:
Tell me about other countries that you visited as well.

Lisa Jackson:
So I just got back Sunday from the South Pacific. So I went to Australia and to New Zealand. I spent a lot of time in New Zealand schools.

Anthony Godfrey:
Bali High School?

Lisa Jackson:
No, no, I'm sorry, I did not go there. (laughs)

Anthony Godfrey:
South Pacific Musical Reference, yes.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, yeah.

Anthony Godfrey:
Tell me about the schools there.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, you know what? Gorgeous country, gorgeous country. Lots of collaboration, and like I said earlier, not to categorize every single school into one idea, because the different schools we went to were all so different. The very first school we went to was a primary school. It was a two-room school. There was two teachers and one principal. The one teacher taught K through three all together. Four through six was the other teacher, and the principal did all the pullouts.

Then we went to another school that was brand new, just opened in 2022. Gorgeous facility. But that one had, so when they're finished, they'll have about 900 students. What I loved about them was they're very collaborative. It was built with all glass doors and you can slide all the doors open so all the classrooms combine. So a very collaborative approach. Yeah, which I loved. Loved that.

I will say the one thing I took away from this trip that I just came back on, I kept marveling at the scenery and how beautiful New Zealand is. We were sitting at one school and I was sitting in their faculty room looking out the window thinking I would love this view. And then I started thinking, hold on. I am at Fort Herriman Middle School. If I sit in our library and look out, I have a very similar view of the Oquirrh Mountains. But I'm so used to it that I've never given it the same consideration and had the same admiration for mountains that I live by. So I walked away thinking, oh, I need to value, I live in a beautiful state. And I don't think about that. I travel all over looking for beauty and it's right here.

Anthony Godfrey:
It's a great thought. And I do this to my kids and probably others listening do the same thing. I stop and say, look at the mountains, look. And they look up from their screen and go “Oh yeah, Dad”, they know what to say. “Yeah, that's beautiful, that's amazing.” And then they go back to their screen. But you're right, we need to pause, we need to stop. I even had an art teacher in high school who was also the wrestling coach and I can remember exactly where I was in class 'cause this seemed like, it was a surprising quote from him. He just said, "You know, you guys need to stop and look at the sky. It's gorgeous and too frequently we don't stop and look up." And I've always remembered that. You have to look around yourself and be really intentional about noticing the beauty around here because people come and they marvel at how close we are to the mountains.

Lisa Jackson:
Right, right.

Anthony Godfrey:
There were some other things that when you came back from these trips you really valued about the United States and Utah and Jordan School District education. Because you go and you learn new things from them, but you also come to appreciate some things that are in place here.

Lisa Jackson:
Absolutely. Yeah, I mean we have a lot of good things going and I'm always excited to share with them. I'm proud to be part of Jordan School District. I'm proud to live in Utah. I'm proud to be American. So I love to share all of those things with people in other countries to learn from theirs. I think we do a lot of things right. I think we're really good at building relationships with kids. I think that we are really good at looking at a student as an individual rather than a whole group or a cohort of kids. I think we are really good at professional development. I think that's something I didn't see in other countries is quite as much bringing our teachers and our administrators together and learning from each other and learning from other people in our field. So there's a lot we're doing right. There's a lot we have to be proud of.

Anthony Godfrey:
Stay with us. When we come back more from Lisa Jackson on her love for world education travel.

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Break:
Are you looking for a job right now? Looking to work in a fun and supportive environment with great pay and a rewarding career? Jordan School District is hiring. We're currently filling full and part-time positions. You can work and make a difference in young lives and education as a classroom assistant or a substitute teacher. Apply to work in one of our school cafeterias where our lunch staff serves up big smiles with great food every day. We're also looking to hire custodians and bus drivers. In Jordan School District we like to say people come for the job and enjoy the adventure. Apply today at employment.jordandistrict.org.

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Anthony Godfrey:
Now you went to Finland, did you go to other countries in Europe as well?

Lisa Jackson:
I did, I went to Sweden and I went to Estonia.

Anthony Godfrey:
So tell me about Sweden and Estonia. I've never been to any of those countries.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, so Estonia is by far my favorite. Gorgeous, gorgeous country, all cobblestone, old, old architecture, lots of castle-looking type buildings. The people were incredibly friendly. The cost of living there is really low. I just really enjoyed Estonia.

We went to several schools in Estonia and I enjoyed talking to their educators. In several of these countries, we've been able to meet with their Ministry of Education and see what they're doing and what they're bringing into their schools. I just really enjoyed those conversations and those collaborations.

Anthony Godfrey:
What sense did you get for education in Estonia? The general focus or what would it be like to be an educator in Estonia from what you can tell?

Lisa Jackson:
They're very focused on digital literacy. In fact, we went to E-Estonia and talked all about how they're bringing technology into just changing their whole education system. So they're focused on technology there. They're much like Finland in their education system but they have a very technology-centered focus. And both countries, both Estonia and Finland, you know they were under Soviet rule for so long and they've brought themselves out of poverty and really they've done a lot of that through their education system so they have a lot to be proud of.

Anthony Godfrey:
Wow, that's fantastic. How about Sweden? What was Sweden like?

Lisa Jackson:
So in Sweden I didn't get into schools, but we did have educators with us on all of our cultural experiences so those were a lot more of just casual, real conversations with teachers and one principal that was with us. Just conversations about what education is like.

Anthony Godfrey:
You brought books with pictures from your travels, and on the front of these books, there's a picture of the group that you traveled with. Have you made some great connections with the people you've traveled with, in addition to the people that you visited?

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, that's been one of my favorite parts of this. I have made lasting friendships with people from all over the country, and I would say that we're genuinely good friends now. When I first went to Africa, my very first trip doing this, I had my daughter with me. And on this last trip, so that was in 2016, we're now 2023, and I went on this trip, and I took a picture with a lady who my daughter had kind of bonded with. They both played college softball. I sent that to my daughter and she immediately sent a picture of her and that lady on top of a safari van in Africa. And it's just sweet how people I met in 2016, I'm still talking to. I've met some great friends from Philadelphia, from New York, from Florida. I've actually tried to recruit a couple of them to come to our district.

Anthony Godfrey:
Good, good. Recruit worldwide for Jordan School District.

Lisa Jackson:
I've tried, I've tried.

Anthony Godfrey:
That's awesome, it's amazing as I look through this, the remote areas that you were able to see, and monkeys out in the wild, and rapids in Africa that you're traveling through, and that's remarkable.

Something that's exciting about what I see of your travels as I look through the book here is that you're really embedding yourself. You're really getting to know the locals and the local area because of the nature of the trip, but also just because of your spirit of adventure here as you go through. I love that. So this is not a tourist trip. This is a trip where you get to know people, where you help people and you learn from people.

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, absolutely. Which is what has drawn me to Global Education Allies, that they do get you in with local people. We get into people's homes, we get into schools, colleges, libraries, museums, places I may not go if I was just traveling there for vacation.

Anthony Godfrey:
Yeah, if someone wanted to be involved in Global Education Allies, how would they go about doing that?

Lisa Jackson:
Yeah, they have a great website that tells you all the information, and there's other companies as well that do these kinds of trips. This is just one I've connected with early and I've stuck with. But you can look them up on the web. I'm happy to tell anyone about my experiences with them. I think they're a great organization. I've loved every minute of my trips with them. So I encourage people to just get out.

And my thing is how much I've changed, how much my view of the world has changed by seeing more than just my little world here. And so it's one thing I highly encourage my own kids to do is just get out and travel and see what the world is really like.

Anthony Godfrey:
And it's a good message overall. Learn from the people around you as much as you can, like you said about appreciating the scenery that we have here and what we have here.

Well, you're a great example of putting yourself out there, making sure you maintain a sense of adventure, and more than anything, curiosity about how things work elsewhere and what we can learn from the people around us. So thank you for spending time talking with us. This is really exciting, and I can't wait to hear about your future trips.

Lisa Jackson:
Thank you so much for having me. It was great.

Anthony Godfrey:
Thanks for joining us on another episode of the Supercast. Remember, education is the most important thing you will do today. We'll see you out there.

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